Comments, opinions and an occasional ramble
How to avoid being convicted of sedition
It seems that Gopalan Nair is now being charged for sedition.
According to the Sedition Act (available here), it seems that Nair has only four possible defenses against the charge of sedition.
(2) Notwithstanding subsection (1), any act, speech, words, publication or other thing shall not be deemed to be seditious by reason only that it has a tendency —
(a) to show that the Government has been misled or mistaken in any of its measures;
(b) to point out errors or defects in the Government or the Constitution as by law established or in legislation or in the administration of justice with a view to the remedying of such errors or defects;
(c) to persuade the citizens of Singapore or the residents in Singapore to attempt to procure by lawful means the alteration of any matter in Singapore; or
(d) to point out, with a view to their removal, any matters producing or having a tendency to produce feelings of ill-will and enmity between different races or classes of the population of Singapore.
I think point C is quite interesting. Let’s have some hypothetical scenarios:
Person A thinks the government is corrupt. He then goes on to publish and distribute a publication to other people accusing the government of corruption. Does it mean Person A can get away with it by adding in a line somewhere that encourages people to vote the existing government that is corrupt in his eyes out of office? Afterall, voting out an existing government is a lawful way of resolving the matter.
Person B is a racist. He publishes all sorts of racist remarks and distributes them widely. In each of his racist publication, he encourages people of his race to lobby their representatives in the legislature to pass a law that marginalise other races. Can Person B get away with publishing the racist comments? After all, he is not asking people to riot and create unrest but rather, he is encouraging the use lawful procedures to enforce his racist beliefs.
I don’t have the answers. It’s just interesting to read that “any act, speech, words, publication or other thing shall not be deemed to be seditious” if there is an “attempt to procure by lawful means the alteration of any matter in Singapore”.
If anyone reading this entry thinks that this entry has a seditious tendency, please note I’m writing this in the spirit of point B. 
| Print article | This entry was posted by Aaron Ng on 05/06/2008 at 11:34 am, and is filed under Perspective. Follow any responses to this post through RSS 2.0. You can leave a response or trackback from your own site. |
about 2 years ago
Sedition is the most anti-democratic of laws in ANY country. The sedition law in the U.S. was ruled unconstitutional in 1964 in New York Times v. Sullivan as antithetic to democracy.
Quoting a 1943 opinion by the great Justice Brandeis the unanimous Court said:
“‘Those who won our independence believed . . . that public discussion is a political duty, and that this should be a fundamental principle of the American government. They recognized the risks to which all human institutions are subject. But they knew that order cannot be secured merely through fear of punishment for its infraction; that it is hazardous to discourage thought, hope and imagination; that fear breeds repression; that repression breeds hate; that hate menaces stable government; that the path of safety lies in the opportunity to discuss freely supposed grievances and proposed remedies, and that the fitting remedy for evil counsels is good ones. Believing in the power of reason as applied through public discussion, they eschewed silence coerced by law — the argument of force in its worst form. Recognizing the occasional tyrannies of governing majorities, they amended the Constitution so that free speech and assembly should be guaranteed.’
Thus, we consider this case against the background of a profound national commitment to the principle that debate on public issues should be uninhibited, robust, and wide-open, and that it may well include vehement, caustic, and sometimes unpleasantly sharp attacks on government and public officials.”
The unanimous Court ruled the sedition act unconstitutional precisely “because of the restraint it imposed upon criticism of government and public officials.”
What a shame that government officials of Singapore fear free political discussion. They would do well to tolerate public criticism in the spirit of hearing “supposed grievances and proposed remedies.” That is the heart of democracy.
about 2 years ago
Hello Linda Perry
As a foreigner. You should be mindful that you do not impose your values on us. I would just like to reiterate that this is the position of our blogging community.
“At 07 May, 2008 14:50 , Yawning Bread Sampler said…
To anonymous, 7 may 2008, 12:04
The problem lies in the word “anonymous”. Cherian’s argument is that decisions in society should be made by consulting as widely as possible, but I would add (and I am sure he agrees with me) that there will be limits, and one of those limits could be that participants must participate openly in the process.
Just as citizens need to identify themselves at polling booths, so it is not invalid to require that people wanting to be involved should identify themselves and stand up for their beliefs. In the absence of that, how would anyone even know that the “anonymous blogger” is Singaporean in the first place? And if we can’t be sure he is Singaporean, how does one justify his inclusion in a Singapore-societal discussion?”
As you can see. Your position has absolutely no justification in the Singapore-societal discussion. So you should in future desist from posting such controversial statements.
I cannot wait for the day when bloggers manage the internet themselves. Then we can deal with riff-raffs like GN.
May I remind you and your friends Linda. The above statement is universally agreed by the entire singaporean blogging community. As you can see we have the resolve to face this matter and even deal with it under our own terms.
about 2 years ago
Dear pudek,
I am sorry that you believe that foreigners should desist from expressing opinions about what they observe while in your fair country. I am not trying to impose my values. I only offer an humble opinion.
I am unable to follow your logic in quoting a blogger about anonymity, when clearly I have chosen not to remain anonymous. I do not see how this quote proves I have “no justification” in expressing opinion.
While government officials have famously said that foreigners should not offer opinions about matters in Singapore, I have not seen evidence that this is “universally agreed” to by the “entire singaporean blogging community.” Bloggers can post a notice on their blogs if they do not welcome opinions from visitors to their country or foreign readers of their very public blogs. If a blogger posts such a notice, I will not participate in the debate raised on his or her blog. In the absence of such a notice, I will assume the blogger tolerates opinions expressed by all who read his/her blog.
about 2 years ago
Reading the Gopalan’s Blog, I cannot help feeling that he has extreme hatred for the Singapore Government.
And I do agree with ‘pudek’, I just like to add that not all countries can function well and bring prosperity to their country with full democracy like America.
about 2 years ago
Lenox,
The point made by Linda isn’t that democracy brings prosperity. What she said was merely that human beings are not saints and even the seemingly perfect human can fail sometimes. To safeguard against such an occurrence, it is necessary to have a democracy that does not impose any restrictions on speech so that such failings can be exposed and rectified.
Anyway, to respond to your issue of democracy AND economic propserity, sure, Singapore has done well without the American style of democracy but Singapore’s system, unlike America’s, has yet to withstand the test of time. The American system has worked on the same principle for a few hundred years but our version of democracy has worked for less than 50 years. If our system can indeed continue to bring prosperity for another 100 years, then I can conclude that our version of democracy indeed brings about great economic prosperity.
about 2 years ago
it’s interesting when Singaporeans say that foreigners cannot comment on local politics or policies because they are foreigners. Hmm.. Why do i read so many forum articles from Singaporeans about the fuel hike in Malaysia. Foreigners (Singaporeans) shouldn’t interfere with local (Malaysia’s) politics. Double standards.
It’s time we realize that local politics do not just impact the locals. It’s a globalized world we’re living in.
about 2 years ago
Hi
I think its fair to say politics cuts across borders, culture and interest. It’s no respecter of false boundaries. It’s quite futile to control people from drawing analogies between lets say what is happening in N.Korea and Burma. Or even drawing lessons from the recent fuel hikes in KL to make sense of a bag of rice in NTUC.This is how people have traditionally made sense of place, scale and perspective. I don’t think this will ever change any more than even Thomas Jefferson consulted the works of Montesquie (a foreigner I might add) when he was drafting the Bill of Rights. Denying this whole idea, thoughts can migrate, can be imported, can be exported, can be localised, is like saying the world is flat. I dont believe Yawning Bread (Alex Au) and Dr Cherian George really knows what they are talking abt. They have to be talking shit. Do they even know what will be the long term implications, if they pursue such a narrow ideal to its logical end?
The question that I find myself asking is what would the Community Regulator do if it was in force?
You know what really troubles me and my friends no end? I cannot answer that question. No wonder all the clever folk have left the local blog scene for greener pastures.
Pyong Yang here we come!
about 2 years ago
“universally agreed” to by the “entire singaporean blogging community.”
Poll it then! I dare you! what are you really waiting for? You know my dad is just a plumber, but we were all brought up with one understanding. REAL GOLD IS NOT AFRAID OF FIRE! So why not subject it to the acid test. That way Pudek when you say it is “universally agreed,” then it is “universally agreed.” That way when you say “entire singaporean blogging community,” it is really the “entire singaporean blogging community.” Let just come down to earth. The REAL REASON WHY THEY ARE NOT POLLING IT, IS They ALL know, they cannot even garner 5% of the votes in blogland. Most netizens have boycotted this whole enterprise. Why?
about 2 years ago
Noted no such charge at the moment
about 2 years ago
Dear Linda Perry, I thank you as a Singaporean for sharing the legal arguments on sedition. As for the subject of whether foreigners should desist from expressing opinions about what they observe, we have one geriatic who should have been taken to task many times for making negative remarks about the neighboring countries of of Indonesia, Philippines, Thailand, and Malaysia, to name a few. The late Deng Xiao Peng was so irked by his unwelcome comments on the Taiwan-China issue, he told him off, “This is between family, you are not family.” But he never learnt.
about 2 years ago
Dear Keng Lee,
Thank you for your kind indulgence of my participation in this discussion. I suppose this geriatric felt comfortable expressing her opinion because she live and works here among many kind Singaporeans and pays taxes here. I guess it’s quite American of me to believe that taxation requires some kind of representation. I have no vote, but I have a voice. And a computer with Internet access.
about 2 years ago
Dear Dr Perry,
You are mistaken. By “geriatric”, Keng Lee is not referring to you — he is referring to Lee Kuan Yew.
P.S. When I was in NUS, I took NM2220. I haven’t forgotten you yet.
about 2 years ago
I’m American. I’m tired of hearing Singaporeans complain about America. So I hope my government can start monitoring all the Singaporean blogs and identify all the people who have written something insulting about Bush or any American public servant. Then, when the Singaporean travels to the US, I want them to be arrested and charged with insulting us, speaking without a permit, sedition etc., then sued, jailed, and then we’ll talk about how good America is compared to Singapore in our press. Hey, maybe even we can bring back caning just to deal with irritating Singaporean visitors to our country. Then, after the Singaporean backside is all scarred and bleeding, we’ll tell them to stop interfering and they’d better shut up about America.
about 2 years ago
Dear Daniel,
Please do not lump all Singaporeans together. Some of us are aware that our dear leaders and some of our fellow countrymen apply double standards.
Not all of us are sheep.
about 2 years ago
Hahahaha. Why am I here?
bc of this:
“The job of a citizen is to keep his mouth open” – Gunter Grass. Are Singaporeans satisfied with the state of Internet regulation as existing? If not, what changes do we wish to see and how can a bottom-up desire for reform translate into policy review? Can Singapore afford the political and social costs of free speech? Is there a contradiction between wanting freedom for political speech and controls over social speech? Is technology really in the driver’s seat? Are governments powerless in the face of a global Internet? Organised by the Wee Kim Wee School of Communication and Information – NTU, the event will be held on 21 June 2008, 2-5 pm in URA Centre, Maxwell Road, Function Hall, Level 5. The admission is free and RSVP is required. The speakers for the event will be Mr Arun Mahizhnan, Deputy Director, Institute of Policy Studies and presentations made by members of the Bloggers’ Group for Internet Deregulation and chaired by Asst Prof Cherian George, Wee Kim Wee School, NTU.
To register (RSVP), please send an empty email to : irr-singapore-subscribe@googlegroups.com. You will get an email response asking you to confirm your request.”
My advise is boycott it. I will fight you tooth and nail on this and the pleasure will be mine.
Darkness 2008
about 2 years ago
“Reading the Gopalan’s Blog, I cannot help feeling that he has extreme hatred for the Singapore Government.”
and why can’t the joker understand this hate?
because the joker failed to understand the first post.
“But they knew that order cannot be secured merely through fear of punishment for its infraction; that it is hazardous to discourage thought, hope and imagination; that fear breeds repression; that repression breeds hate; that hate menaces stable government; that the path of safety lies in the opportunity to discuss freely supposed grievances and proposed remedies, and that the fitting remedy for evil counsels is good ones.”
1Co 4:12,13 We wear ourselves out from working with our own hands. When insulted, we bless. When persecuted, we endure. When slandered, we answer with kind words.
“Thus, we consider this case against the background of a profound national commitment to the principle that debate on public issues should be uninhibited, robust, and wide-open, and that it may well include vehement, caustic, and sometimes unpleasantly sharp attacks on government and public officials.”
real leaders hold their heads up high even when pelted with rotten eggs by the public! cowards mend their image with a stroke of the pen!
about 2 years ago
Aaron, you left out the line immediately after the section you quoted, which states:
“if such act, speech, words, publication or other thing has not otherwise in fact a seditious tendency”.
In other words (as I understand it) a,b,c or d are not valid defence if what you are doing/saying is indeed seditious.
Or, to illustrate using terms from the Act itself, you may not “bring into hatred or contempt or to excite disaffection against the administration of justice in Singapore”, unless it is “to point out errors or defects… in the administration of justice with a view to the remedying of such errors or defects”, except if it would “bring into hatred or contempt or to excite disaffection against the administration of justice in Singapore”.
Looks water-tight to me.
about 2 years ago
in ah bengs language for those too dim to understand. ..if the public hates you, you use the laws and fuck them? wtf! fucking think why the public hates you first lah! oi, nobody insult public servants for no rhymes and reasons lah fuck! and you think bengs or lians like me talk like angry doc meh? fuck!
doc use high class language but say same thing as low class language lah. so if i cant express high class fucking polite hypocritical talk cock session and only know how to shoot my mouth honestly…where does it leave me? in janbung jail house rock ah? fuck! i dont see your fucking prick bigger than an ah bengs fucking prick, do you?
about 2 years ago
BIG,STRONG N FRIENDLY THAN D AH BENGS! Dont u agree angy soh leh?
about 2 years ago
Linda Perry for the next PM!
about 2 years ago
Dear Selene Cheng,
I remember you too!
I actually understood the reference to Singapore’s most famous geriatric. As a young geriatric,
I was comparing myself to him.
Uh oh. Is that defamatory?
about 2 years ago
Dear Obama,
I voted for you, dude! Is this quid pro quo?
about 2 years ago
Hello Darkness.
I am happy to see you and the boys are still in the good fight Darkness. It’s always reassuring to know someone is watching over us. No pun intended
BTW when is the big ship going to come? We have all been waiting for such a long time.
about 2 years ago
Dear Valued Readers,
The game is finally up. There’s no Noah’s Ark. No big space ship. No journey of a life time. No promised land. I just made it all up in my head along with all the tickets I sold. It had to be this way otherwise the pandemonium to close shop would be something that would freak out too many readers. Can anyone tell me how could we have dismantled the read clubs and SLF’s otherwise? Get my drift? Understand now? No it’s not politics, it’s not even circumstances, it’s just me. Yes, I am two faced, untrustworthy and probably the most undependable person who ever set foot on this planet. I am not proud of that myself. It’s best you all hold on to such bitter memories whenever you think about me. Don’t look back, never ever look back, just keep putting one foot in front of another and I hope you have a good life. So forget and move on with your life. It’s over, the show that is.
I know, I started this circus show. I know, I should at least be or pretend to be more responsible about this whole business, but I like I said, I am not the staying type. It’s a vampire thing. I’ve tried to reform myself. I thought it will be different this time, but what can I say? You could even say it’s my nature. Men like me keep a gym bag in the boot of the car, two shirts, two pants, a toothbrush and a fifty dollar note, just so they can pick and go in a blink an eye. Anything can trigger it off, the haunting refrain of a flock of birds in the early morn – the swell of a wave as it curls in the moonlight – anything. Like now. We are just trash. And no one in their right mind puts their trust and hopes on a lousy bet, that’s really what I am. So now you all know the truth.
You’re home at last.
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=6zK2eEiDnBU&feature=related
Darkness
about 2 years ago
My Dearest Bambi Darkness Baby Bad Boy
You don’t need to explain. Besides you’re not that smart. Most of us already know it. Believe it or not, we can all read you like a book. You see, you put too much of your heart into what you wrote.
“I imagine it must be very difficult for you to understand how two people who came so close to each other in one moment in time can suddenly find themselves behaving like strangers – perhaps she like I realized we were people cut from the same cloth – people who did not quite own enough of themselves to even give a part of themselves to others – people like us can never speak of the future, or for that matter even the past – all we can really ever do is to live for the moment.
We were like, children whispering secretly in the dark when all that resonates in the house is the deep rest of sleep.
Tomorrow the giants will awake.”
http://intelligentsingaporean.wordpress.com/2005/02/19/the-confessions-of-a-singaporean-gangster-in-london-chapter-14-%e2%80%9cchildren-whispering-in-the-night%e2%80%9d/
No need to explain silly man. We all understand.
about 2 years ago
Begin forwarded message:
From: ThermosFlask
Date: 11 June 2008 4:36:09 PM
To: ThermosFlask
lee_hsien_loong@pmo.gov.sg, v_bala@mcys.gov.sg, cyberboey@yahoo.com, delia.teo@gmail.com, elainech@gmail.com, lilykong@nus.edu.sg, ksbwong@nie.edu.sg, pvoedu@nus.edu.sg, sppdean@nus.edu.sg, sppsak@nus.edu.sg
Fucking PAP cronies.
On 11/06/2008, at 4:33 PM, ThermosFlask wrote:
Did the govt do its job? What sort of accountability for its brand promise?
On 11/06/2008, at 4:30 PM, ThermosFlask wrote:
So much for the Ivies.
On 11/06/2008, at 4:24 PM, ThermosFlask wrote:
Particularly when it is not even dark enough.
Maybe it’d be instructive a reminder that they should teach their children proper?
On 11/06/2008, at 4:20 PM, ThermosFlask wrote:
On 11/06/2008, at 4:19 PM, ThermosFlask wrote:
Very cathartic.
The more open I am about things, the freer I feel.
And then less tense I become.
That some things are too dark is not my business.
I do whatever it takes to relieve that tension.
On 11/06/2008, at 4:13 PM, ThermosFlask wrote:
On 11/06/2008, at 4:09 PM, ThermosFlask wrote:
WHY YOU SPEND SO MUCH TIMES TO CURSE,HUMILIATE ,AND INSULT PEOPLE ON ALL YOUR EMAIL.? WHAT CAN YOU ACHIEVE FROM ALL THESE NONSENSE.
Oh I actually achieve a lot.
Some people don’t ever get any awareness of such things until it is done to them.
Especially the government.
about 2 years ago
From: ThermosFlask
Date: 11 June 2008 4:46:24 PM
To: ThermosFlask
lee_hsien_loong@pmo.gov.sg, v_bala@mcys.gov.sg, cyberboey@yahoo.com, delia.teo@gmail.com, elainech@gmail.com, lilykong@nus.edu.sg, ksbwong@nie.edu.sg, pvoedu@nus.edu.sg, sppdean@nus.edu.sg, sppsak@nus.edu.sg
And if you wanted to be up there on the grease pole, don’t give me your fucked up ideas about how much money you think you ought to have and still complain that people are ungrateful.
If you’re so unhappy, go elsewhere. If you’re so unhappy, don’t put on a noble face and do grudging work.
Or at least, I know what I treasure more.
about 2 years ago
We have given our answer.
about 2 years ago
One more thing. A story we dreamt of:
She rides him.
She’s crying but it doesn’t matter. She’s being moved by a series of machinistic contraptions that look like they came from Sterlac.
Camera zooms in.
A surgical knife is tracing his skin.
There are no floor tiles. Every bit of the floor is covered by everyone else. The perpetrators in the chamber wear steel-toed boots with 2-inch nails for soles.
Wee Shu Min and the likes of the same kind (as like ministers’ sons and daughters) are in the playground.
Children can do anything with them. In whatever way. It is a means of knowing how much the human can take.
Those whom are close within the networks of that inner circle and are Christians, we crucify.
Upside down.
As a public art exhibition in the heat of Pulau Tekong.
And we start in mid-afternoon, so that we may leave in the evening.
The site is BMTC1.
What happens to the family happens in a cube entirely made of glass.
It is suspended in a factory-like setting with large rusted iron beams. The factory is very large.
It is maintained by their own civil servants. The levers that operate it are done by their perm secs.
The bottom of the cubes has holes like grills on a sewage hole cover.
It drips of course with blood.
There is no way of suggesting that those who drink it are the peasants and farmers. There’s no fun in representing what’s already there.
The ones that drink it are civil servants, in particular, government scholars too obedient. They’ve already been brainwashed. Their minds have been turned to dislike their masters.
Everything is done slowly.
It is a tourist attraction aimed to illustrate the principle of “Do unto others what you want to have done unto you” as was sang in Chris Ho’s “Mouthless Fish” as performed by his band Zircon Gov. Pawn Starz.
++-The End-++
about 2 years ago
“the good fight”
We do not have faith in them.
about 2 years ago
//And, final thoughts on religion
I doubt there’s a God.
Hell’s just dreamed up by supposed saints and scholars who wouldn’t admit to their own dark machinations of the mind.
Because essentially, the overidentification with The Good and Supremely Beautiful (that which is termed “God”), is an extremist position which merely says:
“When I’m in Heaven and with The Father, Let’s See What He’ll Do to You.”
In modern day language, we call that a “terrorist”.
In this perspective then, the bible is a collection of books for an individual journey.
It is NOT a holy book.
And thereby, it centres the individual experience in public experience and thus allows for the actual exercise of the Golden Rule principle.
Otherwise there is absolutely no way of understanding people who are more likely to not lie about what they experience.
In this view then, obviously, the religious world is entirely misguided.
In this view then, obviously, the notion of religion is that of what is considered “scientific”. It is scientific insofar as it is knowledge from observation; that it is observation of the inner as opposed to outer renders it “religion”.
Maybe that’s why religion is first and foremost the binding experience of community.
And therefore, the politician who thinks religion a tool for the use of governance following the sentiments of Marx is incorrect.
Yet, the same perspective renders all churches useless.
Because they’re all false anyway.
And thereby is: “My life my religion”.
Clearly, going by this view as well, most Christians are false Christians.
Especially the Singaporean kind.
I’ve merely told you my life.
That it is about religion is inevitable. Because mine is a religious life.
To say that I discussed and/or wrote about religion is mere misrepresentation of my sentiments.
I’ve merely communicated my experience of life.
If you need to be evangelize in the common notion of the word then, you must be a damn lousy Christian.
Because to “tell the good news” to me, means comforting the person in need.
To comfort another, by no means, requires religion.
It is not only disrespectful to approach another in that manner.
It also means that you do not have the ability for counsel.
ie. A sacred devotion towards a lack of empathetic communication.
Why else would Christians preach from the bible anyway?
Sigh… “Speaking into the air”.
That by itself, would bump most Protestants off the radar already, wouldn’t it?
How fun. Now I can say I pray to Satan.
about 2 years ago
Hello
I don’t have much to say. I am looking for Darkness of the Brotherhood. I am sorry to speak out of point to the main thread, but we are really at our wits end as to how to best touch base with them. Can someone please help us to tell him, we would like to conduct a face to face interview with him.
We know there are some of you out there who are clearly brotherhood yourself e.g inspir3d, Singapore daily and perhaps even a few others. So do help as this is very important for the well being of our country.
We are prepared to pay a finder’s fee. We have been trying to establish contact with them, but all their channels seems to be off-line.
Do help us. Many Thanks and do have a very nice day.
Best Regards
Hua Wei
about 2 years ago
R U from ISD?
If u r, why not try contacting Mas Selamat first?
May be he can help you?
about 2 years ago
Dear Hua Wei,
Maybe you should go and ask those urination experts for directions? Or some site that claims to be the closest thing to Malaysiankini?
What do you call self praise?
Frankly, I never knew Malaysiakini writers regularly get $ for doing the things they do from the establishment like the writers of this site that claims to be a mini version of them.
One thing is clear. They’ve burnt everything and left town for good. Trust me. You do not fuck with this people. When they pull the plug. They really do it so well everything is just burnt to a cinder. Remember icered.com? They even promised the HK govt, they will return, but what happened?
Even I cannot find them. And I know them. I am the bird of prey. A nominated contractor who acts on behalf of the brotherhood.
As for the brotherhood, don’t even bother asking them. One brother will always support another brother. Their allies are even worse. They all have mouths as tight as oysters. You will get nada from them. Waste of time only. I rather take my chances with a needle in the haystack any day.
It’s finished. Get used to it! But it was good when it lasted. Nevertheless, if the finder’s fee is right, I will consider delivering the message.
Btw how much is it?
Bird of Prey
about 2 years ago
Why are you so money faced Bird of Prey? Why don’t you try to make yourself useful for once in your life?
I don’t think Hua Weih is a very rich person. Neither do I believe the crowd she represents is loaded even.
You already have the black book. So what’s the bother of just flipping it and letting your beak do the running around?
about 2 years ago
Let’s all try to remain calm. What does it matter, if that greedy Buzzard refuses to help us all? They have already given us a rigorous explanation as to what will have to happen and why? As Darkness once said the motivation is simply “too compelling and strong.”
Let’s calm down and try to take stock what has and will happen.
(1) Darkness mentions again and again. The founding idea derives much of it’s subsistence very much like religion. He mentions again and again, miracles must feature. Exaltation. Edification along with glorification. Otherwise how will people even come to believe it’s important. And if it’s not perceived to be generally important, then how can it possibly assume relevance. Without relevance power cannot be appropriated.
This I believe is why we are seeing the likes of “Many Teddies.” All he does is supply an endless cause why anon commentators should be banned, registered, moderated and regulated. Who sends him? If you look very carefully, he even takes the trouble to post all the e-mail address of certain govt figures. Why? Who has the time to even search out their addresses? What is he trying to say by posting in the fashion that he does? Why does Gopalan Nair go to jail, yet Many Teddies gets immunity? He’s simply an agent, who has the agenda of trying so very hard to justify the whole idea of regulation. Another reason that gives his position away is he tries too hard. Wherever the brotherhood goes. He mucks up their thread. He hassles them. He messes it up. So what we have here is a confirmed counter insurgent. What better way to justify the placement of the fire dept by starting fires?
The other miracle, we have all seen this is, the newspapers openly support the 15 bloggers.
This is not unusual, when you consider the head of AIMS (the committee that is supposed to advise our govt on the internet) coincidentally happens also head it? So what we are likely to see is AIMS even giving it’s tacit support to this whole idea of community moderation.
So let’s see what will happen next. I am not very concerned. I happen to know Darkness personally. I can tell you, he is indeed a very persuasive man who comes across as reasonable and even elaborately intelligent. For instance when he once fought with his church. 5 CEO’s, real business heads who run fortune 500 companies were sent to influence him to go back to the body of christ and end his mega sulking. He invited them to go cycling with him in Bukit Timah. After a few session of running around in the jungle. That Rasputin managed to turn all of them against his own church! Not only did they openly support him, they considered him their leader! Eventually they even undermined the authority of those who sent them by stopping church funds by co-opting the biggest donors!
So we are dealing here with master chess player.
Now they appear to have gone underground. That also means, the war will get more complicated from now onwards. They will speak to industry leaders. They will shake hands and whisper words. This is where they are deadliest.
As for the likes of Many Teddies, it will get worse. As I said miracles must be take place.
I will be taking my leave now. Most have already gone.
about 2 years ago
Very long post as well. I know. But I owe those boys that much. This has been stuck in my throat for a long time. No apology.
about 2 years ago
The Brotherhood have alway subscribed to the policy of “live and let live” in the virtual. They are not exactly the nicest people around, but they are not any where as “kaypoh” or “intrusive” like these small minority of people who are seeking to regulate the net for presumably our welfare. Personally if it is so urgent a case, why is Singapore the only country proposing community moderation? Can someone tell me one other country who has successfully pursued this strategy?
Based on my dealings with them, if you don’t kachau them. They will leave you pretty much alone. Every goes to their respective corner and do’s their thing so to speak. Based on what I see. The problem really comes when you go and disturb them and it doesn’t matter whether it’s a group, a govt or even an org. These are nomads, so when you come in and say, you want to redrawn the map or move them into a fenced settlement/ You are really asking for trouble. They will fight back. Even if it means they will have to cut off their nose to spite you, they will do it. It will hurt. From what I see, they seem to pursuing a scorch earth strategy. It’s too early to say whether it will work. But drive out the intelligent material and presumably the intelligent people leave as well? That’s ok if our net is so varied that it can regenerate itself to make up for the short fall. Can it? Talk is very easy but when it comes to doing, its another matter. I remember when “many teddies” started messing up their thread in the Singapore Daily. Darkness Boy took one thread and pinned it to the “most popular” for nearly three weeks! The equivalent of humiliating him and saying, “what you want me to be. I will not be and not only will I refuse to be that. I will do the direct opposite. You do not even deserve to win one single round!” What they don’t tell us all is what they are proposing will have far reaching implications on the rest of us. Yet there has no even been so much as a poll. Neither has there been any discussion on the matter. Not even the slightest effort to explain to the blogging community what they are trying to accomplish. I have so many questions, but I don’t even know who or where I should direct it too.
My real fear is what happens when the rest of those other bro sites especially aggregators like IS and SD begin to pull out?
about 2 years ago
So far we have only managed to track down, the following. They are very messy when they post. Hardly any system and they do it as if they expect us all to just find it. Actually it is very frustrating to look for their material as most of us do not have the time: http://singaporedaily.net/2008/04/27/sgdaily-roundup-what%e2%80%99s-hot-in-week-17/#comment-1334
http://intelligentsingaporean.wordpress.com/2006/09/21/why-i-would-like-to-leave/#comment-33906
I would greatly appreciate it if someone could direct us to further discussions concerning this whole idea to deregulate the Singapore internet. Many of my Malaysian friends have been asking whether perhaps there is an online forum where all these issues are discussed. They would like to learn from it and see whether perhaps there may be lessons. Many thanks and I really hope it all ends happily ever after.
B
about 2 years ago
I believe the brotherhood have stopped blogging some time during the beginning of this month. From what I have been able to dig up from the boys, its a sort of mass boycott move or something. They dont seem to want to even talk about it. In response to your querries Bertha, they have disappeared completely from the SG radar and presumably moved on to greener pastures to where they’re not subject to “community moderation” or “regulation.” The only articles, essays and post which are regularly posted on their sister site JUST STUFF or DOTSENG seems to be only re – runs.
Even then there’s no point posting there if you want to get more leads. I have tried to post abt a hundred or so times, but it doesn’t even make it to comments pg. I think only a dumb robot is managing the site and it hasn’t figured out how to make the comments appear.
I hope this helps. If I have any further info. I will keep you all informed. However, if someone is willing to come up with $. This would really do alot to motivate me. And I could really put my nose to the wheel. Just a thought.
about 2 years ago
just want to confirm a rumor. Is it true that the Brotherhood has pulled out of town?
Does anyone know how to get in touch with these ppl. e-mail, domain address, homepage etc?
Many thanks
Kelly