Jul 13th, 2007
Punished for blowing the whistle
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I woke up this morning to read that 2LT Li Hongyi, son of PM Lee Hsien Loong, was charged by Mindef for blowing the whistle on a fellow officer. After reading the original email that was composed by Li Hongyi, I honestly do not see what was wrong with what Hongyi has written.
Li Hongyi was punished for not following the chain of command. According to the original email, he reported the matter to his OC, and his OC let the errant colleague get away with just 10 extra duties. Excuse me, I don’t think that AWOL is worth a measly 10 extra duties. I have seen many AWOL cases, and most of them end up in the detention barrack. If there isn’t anything broken with the chain of command system, would Hongyi have to resort to what he did?
The only thing I think wasn’t properly done is that Li Hongyi copied his email to battalions of people. I am not sure why he did that. It seems to me that he wanted to ensure maximum damage to the colleague that he was unhappy with. Actually, he could have achieved his aim with just an email to his CO, copied to his formation chief, chief of army, chief of defence force and the defence minister. The CO would probably take the necessary action after seeing who else was copied in the email, and the entire matter would have been closed satisfactorily without being brought out into the public domain.
I guess Li Hongyi is still young, brash and idealistic, but he’s much better than Wee Shu-min, who, in my opinion, was totally obnoxious in what she wrote some time back. I think Li Hongyi wrote with very valid points, and I’m glad that his dad did a good job of bringing him up. It is unfortunate that some people are are attacking him online for being a member of the Lee family without properly examining the email. Honestly, I think Li Hongyi deserves praise for speaking up against the system. How many “elites” actually do something that is not in their own interests?
It is unfortunate that he was charged for blowing the whistle. It was pretty much the right thing to do, given that his immediate superior was more interested in being a nice guy than to follow military rules. I think there can be some leeway for small matters but to try and turn a blind eye to an officer who apparently has constantly been committing AWOL offences is wrong. The OC also deserves at least a talking to in this matter. And, I think our society needs to protect whistle blowers. If whistle blowers are punished for doing the right thing, who else will bother to do the right thing next time?
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Personally, the reasons why he copied his email to the whole camp might be to really let everyone know about this and allow the matter to permeate to public domain??
I don’t think he expected something sent within Mindef to leak. After all, military law is quite strict.
Actually the OC got more than just a “talking to”. I think he also got officially warned. TODAY reported that “two supervising officers have been issued letters of warning for poor judgment in administering inappropriate disciplinary action.”
I agree with you. Hongyi did the right thing by raising and reporting this matter. Although it was wrong for him to shoot an email up to the Minister, CDF and COA, I can relate with the sentiments of a idealistic young man who saw something wrong and wants as many people as possible to know about it. I guess he let his emotions at that time get the better of him.
Actually, what he is saying in his email is something quite a fair bit of Singaporeans who have served NS have known about for some time. It is really unfortunate that only someone of his status can be heard while the rest of the citizens have their voices silenced. Yet it does give one hope. Does it not? He definitely set high standards for himself. He could have easily just taken up the other officer’s offer and then no need to do duties till he goes off for his studies.
I don’t think he did anything wrong, i support what he did although definitely he shouldn’t have sent it to so many people.
Its high time some people did something and i am very glad that at least he has the guts and spirit to stand up for what is right.
I may be a bit cynical but I think it is actually in his interests to broadcast this as widely as possible. He knew he had a strong case and would in all likelihood be lauded for standing up against the system. If it works, he would be remembered as the elite who had the guts to stand for what is right and with that, he would enjoy public adolation and most probably rise quickly through the system. If it backfires, he would at most get a slap on the wrist considering who he is (you think he will kena DB?), but still be remembered as the elite who had the guts to stand for what is right. If I were him, this is one calculated risk I would take. But if I were a lowly Singaporean like just about everyone else, I would have to think really hard before breaking the chain of command. In the end, I would only be remembered as the fool who broke the rules and landed himself in DB, ruining his entire life.
Knowing how our government works, they will punish him, albeit lightly, to showcase the santicity of the rules (since no man, not even the whitest of white horse, should be above the law) but laud his exemplary behaviour and prime him to become a BG by 32 and then move into politics to become the next PM.
[...] course Hong Yi should be punished. But the punishment should be for the action of emailing just about the whole army world. And this [...]
To add some more info.
In the army enlisted men (cpl/sgt) are often disciplined impartially with punishments severely as a sign of discipline.However this line is blurred when this involves regular (professional?) soldiers , they are given a slap on the wrist (informal punishment extra duties/confinement).Why? because this will affect their career while NSF will do their two years and f@@@ off.These punishments may not be served by offenders as regulars help regular code of ethics are in place. U help me i help u network.
Those NSF servicemen officers are often ranked below regulars (same for enlisted men), thus they will often feel disgruntled as different standards applies.
I felt that Li Hongyi opened a can of worms when he crossed path with LTA X ( Mr Tua Si lang),swapping his duties with somebody.
LTA X should sell his duties to others, which is prevalent in SAF (under table swap for favours/money) to NSF servicemen but not to white horses like Li HongYi.
The supervising OC(Bo tao nao) covered for LTA X should be impartial and get him to do extra duty immediately for 3-5 days so to show others what u will get for running off from duty.But he did not.
I approve and Mr Li Hongyi for opening this can of worms for us to see that SAF has not changed at all so much for increased pay,benefits for Mindef personnel or civil servants, still has double standards for regulars and nsf servicemen , do the same job get different pay, different punishment(informal for regulars,formal for nsf servicemen),different offdays (no off for nsf even u are going to ORD,planned offdays for regular,unofficial MC,see mother to hospital,etc etc).
Why is this so? because nobody blows the whistle on them (the regular i help u u help me network.
hongyi is a martyr, and above all, he loves singapore enough to stick his neck out and do what he did, although i feel that is a little bit extreme.
i believe it is only he who could do it, given who he is and where he comes from. it would have been a very different case if someone else did what he did.
he is a very intelligent person and obviously would have known the consequences of mass-mailing everyone in the military. i strongly doubt an intelligent person with strong values resorting to such extreme measures, did it with an unstable mind and hot head.
the thing about “what happens in the army, stays in the army” is being questioned through the brave actions of hongyi, which have exposed the injustice and rubbish that have been occuring in the military.
hongyi has more balls than guts. he stands for what he believes, and his beliefs are definitely not harmful to singapore. shame on us all who don’t do the same (perhaps we have too much at stake, too much to lose, so it’s better to suffer in silence).
What he did was Good, but hardly heroic. Heroic means doing something at great risk for the great good. While this is for the greater good, it was hardly at great risk as Eric has point out.
Nevertheless, I appreciate what he did, coz regular guys like you and me can’t do it. For us, tt’s not just about risk, it’s that we will definitely fail and we will land in hot soup becoz of it.
Well, none of us can deny his idealism. I just hope the flame doesn’t get snuffed out quickly, or should I say, I hope he doesn’t get corrupted by the system quickly.
Wait a minute.
All of you are singing LHY’s praises. Do you have any idea why he took the step of emailing to “battalions” of people?
First, do you guys realise that he left camp before the other officer arrived? That in itself, is dereliction of duty. An officer shall not leave his post of duty until the next one has arrived to relief the first officer of his duty. Has it ever occured to you all that LHY was also guilty of AWOL? During the interim period between his leaving camp and the arrival of the next officer, he was also absent from his post without official leave!
Think about that, guys. You have all lost the forest for the trees.
i read the first few lines of his email. it seem to me that this was his farewell message with a very disppointing sentiment. i guess this maybe the reason why he email to everbody.
If all the email content was true, I would rather call him fearless and brave (hopefully not because he has a PM dad).
He may not be politically correct. But being young, we all have our days of burning Enthusiasm. Just like many kopitiam story of the dad in his younger days.
If he has to be that politically correct, he could have told his PM dad.
Then people will say “Oh, PM’s boy complaining watch out, watch out…”
What if he went all the way to G1, or any higher enchelon, or whatever secret units and still finding it getting nowhere? Then the casualty number could be even higher?
From what I personally understood, SAF reporting system sucks - I’ve been placed into situations before. Or else, we could have saved many fellow countrymen’s life from improper training procedures or oversights whether due to ignorance, or hot balloons.
In SAF, one has to be also careful of being charged for Insubordination. If one have to jump level, jump high then. Freedom is not free. Rights are neither free.
Not considering the BIG picture and repercussions IS the true wealth of being young and fearless. As someone with many life and work experiences, we tend to become smarter, more shrewd, and cautious. That’s our asset and also liability. We also tend to give too much 2nd-thoughts and wrong the supposed right in many self-doubts.
We all pay a price for our lessons. Questions is, how much? Most NS-folks will …. “Ai-ya… Serve And Fuck-off (stands for SAF) lah… why rock the boat? Me no Minister of Defence or General mah…”
How many of us face our own integrity and challenge our values?
“After reading the original email that was composed by Li Hongyi, I honestly do not see what was wrong with what Hongyi has written.”
I’m surprised that you (and many, many others) don’t. What you see is a brave, public spirited soul breaking protocol for the betterment of society. What I see is a man who holds a grudge, a grudge big enough to run into a 2000 word rant fit for the defence minister’s inbox.
Your view is flawed. The act of whistleblowing per se is “good”, and “right”, in the sense that it enlightens us all, but it’s just as possible that in this case it coincides with selfish interests. If you weren’t very mature, and had all the power and angst in the world to pull somebody down, why wouldn’t you? But of course it’s blasphemous to assume something like that of someone so exalted.
We’ll never know for sure. There’s no point in giving Li Hongyi credit he may not deserve. I’m sure some people will talk about giving him the benefit of the doubt (we’re in dire need of a few heroes, sure), but people have always been doing that. And it’s time to stop.
After going through in detail what has transpired, the 2 distinct sides of a coin still remains. I mean we know what soldiers are like, did Li really go overboard whilst invoking the Esprit De Corps? Could it have been settled in a more pragmatic manner? On the other hand, most of us will notice that this kind of this does happen quite often, going AWOL and probably unnoticed…do we dare not speak up? or do we just assume “what’s new?” and get on with our lives? What would have happened if it was not Li that had sent that same email, would it be any different? I’m still glad he did it, some taxpayers will not be too pleased…jwny
“I don’t think he expected something sent within Mindef to leak. After all, military law is quite strict.”
This is ridiculous reasoning. A friend of mine received this on the same work day it was sent (some weeks ago), and she doesn’t serve national service. Even with all the restrictions on army computers it’s relatively easy to leak something like this out anonymously (it would leave a virtual paper trail, but there are very many cross-uses of computer access cards) with the right utilities.
And you don’t expect something not to leak if you send it to a thousand people (or more, considering that he sent this to several signal battalions) at a shot. This was definitely planned to leak into the public domain.
it’s obviously done with malice….you don’t need a rocket degree to 2nd guess what’s the intention do u? he’s borned with a silver spoon…such character could hardly survives in the real world…
Hi Palisade,
I think it’s probably anyone’s guess as to whether there are indeed selfish intentions involved. I am unable to be sure whether there are intentions involved, so I prefer to comment at face value, which I think is commendable on his part. It is certainly good to hold a little reservation that Hongyi might have been acting out of selfish interests but I say, let’s not presume guilt until conclusively proven.
I still maintain that Hongyi didn’t expect it to leak. I believe the email was sent through Mindef’s intranet system. I believe that all emails within the intranet are at least of a restricted level of classification, which means that it is not meant for public consumption. Anyone taking information out of Mindef intranet has most likely contravened the Official Secrets Act. At least in theory, I believe he did not expect the email to leak. Once again, there might exist the intention to intentionally leak, but until proven otherwise, I prefer to give the benefit of the doubt.
The guy felt he was wronged (perhaps rightly so, but there are two sides to every story). It’s not clear if his decision to unleash the mass email was driven by real concern for the quality of SAF officers, or motivated by anger/vengeance. Perhaps a bit of both. In any case, it’s also not clear if he fully explored and exhausted all avenues to reddress his concerns.
It’s worth applauding individuals for rocking the boat under the right circumstances. The military, however, is NOT one of those places where breaking the chain of command is easily justifiable or should be tolerated. In the grand scheme of things, the perceived injustice suffered by him does not seem in proportion to his actions.
He probably was very wronged in the whole affair that prompted the email, but he also exhibited bad judgment and a martyr complex.
i choose to believe hongyi actually knows how this thing will turn out. he’s a smart guy, whom i believed, had actually thought twice and thought ahead of his actions.
in this case, he could have actually set up this one nicely for it to gain media exposure. very methodical and planned. there’s always a slight probability that through mailing a large number of people, you’ll get the news leaked out of the organisation, and hongyi played it well.
any way, it’s very exciting, right?
patriot. martyr. tactician.
Why is he suddenly so motivated to use a broad security platform to chastigate an entire system/structure? Sure, the SAF has its flaws, just like every institution in Singapore. If he is truly a ‘martyr’ as some are evoking so cavalierly, then why hasn’t he spoken out about other pertinent issues/problems in Singapore that surely he has come across and seen? Perhaps he is only going on a scorched earth diatribe because he feels unjustly punished?
It’s great whenever the SAF or any organisation’s flaws get called out. Hopefully some changes/good will come out of this. But it also wasn’t a completely selfless act on the part of the ranter since he has some direct interest in the situation. At best he comes across as recklessly idealistic, at worse he comes across as a pompous brat full of indignant self-importance.
I really dont know what unit this fellow is in, but I can share with all of you this. In a real fighting unit, leaders cannot afford to behave in this sort of imperial way, bc we all know, we need to work together as part of a team if we want to be effective and efficient.
I am sorry he doesnt get my support, not even so much as a salute, most of us will just turn our backs on him. I have come across garang officers like these bfr and they can never ever get anything done, bc most of the men dont even listen or respect them, there will always be ball lickers but they dont count, half the time, they have to play police and thief thats why they are so tulan.
The officers who get 100% are the brotherly types, if you do wrong, they will just take you to one side and talk to you over a jug of beer like a human being, it may be a longer and more leceh way, but in the long run if you are bengkok u will just straighten up bc you know your actions are affecting others and there is someone to help you. Everything is done quietly and its just between the men and plat commander doesnt even go further up.
That is how it is resolved 99.9% of the time.
This I dont even know what it is and another thing, I dont care to know either, but I know one thing, its certainly not leadership.
“i choose to believe hongyi actually knows how this thing will turn out. he’s a smart guy, whom i believed, had actually thought twice and thought ahead of his actions.
in this case, he could have actually set up this one nicely for it to gain media exposure. very methodical and planned. there’s always a slight probability that through mailing a large number of people, you’ll get the news leaked out of the organisation, and hongyi played it well.
any way, it’s very exciting, right?
patriot. martyr. tactician.”
You obviously know nothing about tactics. All I see is a idiot digging a grave.
“I still maintain that Hongyi didn’t expect it to leak.”
We’ll see.
“I believe the email was sent through Mindef’s intranet system.”
Yes it was.
“I believe that all emails within the intranet are at least of a restricted level of classification, which means that it is not meant for public consumption.”
Look, I know the classification is there, but nobody’s stopping you from leaking it. It is difficult to track the source of leak or leaks when you have, as Hongyi has done, sent his e-mail to at least hundreds of people.
If he had sent it to five people then, yes, he probably wouldn’t expect the e-mail to leak. But the way this e-mail was crafted, meticulous and generously peppered with quotes from the national education archives, suggests a man trying to win over more than a few exalted superiors. He is trying to reach to as many people at one shot as possible. Considering there isn’t actually much in the way of confidential information, you’d say it wouldn’t really matter of these “many people” were in the military or not.
Li HongYi’s email saga is likely a plot by someone to: (1) embrass TCH so that his political power will be deminished in time; (2) pace a way to groom Li HongYi as the next PM, that is, showing that he is righteous person that people can trust in future; (3) try winning votes by showing justice in Spore, i.e. no one is above the law; (4) try showing to the foreigners that Spore system is fair and justice and also open; (5) pace a way to remove certain fractions in the SAF; and (6) try scoring points for LHL and PAP as a whole. (above reasons are not in priority order - it is up to your imagination)
Unfortunately, many bloggers and Singaporeans do not see the whole juncle but only individual trees.
The key questions to ask:
(1) Why such a SAF email can be leaked to the public? Obviously, either this is intentional as a plot for some other more cruel reasons, or this reflect the current status of SAF which means Spore can be in deep shit because of security exposure.
(2) Who has actually copied the email to the public? Some blogs suggest that it is Li’s own family member. If this is so, it is even more likely that this email saga is a plot.
(3) What purnishment he will receive? Li has also violated the SAF rule as a AWOL person (absent without handing over duty to the next on duty) and also did not observe the chain of command for complaint. In US or other 1st world army, such person will be dishonourly discharged from the army, and also charged for betraying the country and leaking of top secrect army information. I do not believe SAF is really serious about this case. This means our national security is just a hollow shell.
This is just another wayang. There will be unexpected backfire.
Kaniabo..leh
Ask his grandfather sue sue sue lah,
Thsi is the last person who are not kiasu lo!
Two supervising officers were issued letters of warning for administering inappropriate punishment.
Think about that.
This means at least two senior officers were aware of the problem and had decided to ignore 2LT Li Hongyi’s complaint.
If 2LT Li had followed the “proper channel”, what makes you think the 3rd senior officer up the chain of command will do anything?
MINDEF needs to clarify what it means by “proper channels”.
Will Li Hongyi be charged if he merely sent his letters to everyone directly above him (ie, Defense Minister, CDF, CoA, Chief Signal Officer, etc)?
The problem with that approach is that all these senior guys may still decide to ignore his complaint. What can he do then? In my opinion, his letter to everyone (including the unit storemen, cook, etc) directly causes the AWOL LTA to be court-martialed.
Cos the SAF leaders are now aware that justice must be seen to be done. Otherwise, they cannot no longer maintain effective discipline among the men.
[...] Li Hongyi incident which surfaced last week saw many Singaporean netizens expressing their support for Hongyi’s [...]
I think perhaps, i have another view, the people already know what happens in the SAF, comon, we all have to serve, however, perhaps this could be part of a long term agenda, for instance, didnt his father, the current PM, serve as a ‘brigadier general’ i use that term in inverted commas, since he’s currently the world record holder for a general without combat experience.
now would people look back when his son is up for elections and thing ‘hey isnt that the guy who blew the whiste, etc etc?
long term propaganda is what i think it is, if anyone else did that, it would be instantly covered up and made to disappear….
now i wonder who is going to be the PAP front man in a couple of years?
think about that. you may support him now for his ‘valiant actions’ but for all you know, it may be a ruse, the news media in singapore is known to be an agent of the government, giving props to the current ruling party for years, and showing the opposition in a poor light.
in this country of not so free press and lack of civil liberties, perhaps we are just all part of a long term plan to keep the lee family in power for years to come.
Unfortunately the issue involves Mindef and the martial law. personally I would have done the same, and as a matter of fact I had done something similar some years before, though nothing to do with Mindef. Unhappy with some arbitrary, unfair, stupid HDB rules, I went to the MP of my constituency and had a few letters sent to HDB to present my case. After several failed attempts over 2 years, I sent an email all the way up to 7 stat boards and ministries, including PMO and Parliament House. That got the case discussed between my MP and the then-minister for HDB during parliament break and was satisfactorily settled in 7 calendar days. Does that sound any different essentially? Only diff is, I’m not restrained by any martial laws and Mindef was not involved. Lee Hong Yi did something justifiable and righteous, but bound by unjust laws, in civilian terms. He might not make a good soldier in the eyes of martial laws, but he sure is righteous and the kind of person we need in our new generation. And this whole saga has portrayed a good image for Singapore internationally, for we have proven that even the top dog can get into deep shit if he doesn’t do things right, even if he is from the Lee family.
Most people believed that he knew of the action he took to writing a complaint and the consequences of mass mailing he complaint.
Seriously speaking, no one in the history of the SAF had ever dared to write this way knowing that he has to follow the given procedures in the handbook.
It was clearly state by Meindef tha evry NS man has been briefed on the procedures in the handbook.
Clearly speaking, given the way he wrote the letter, it seemed clear he knew of the rules in the handbook, etc.
It seemed clear that his mass-copying of it in sending to his peers and other commands showed that he was exasperated by the ignorance given by his superior o nthe metter which indeed had nothing to do with him in the first place.
It seemed clear that his mass circulation was to amplify his arrogance that he had the power to do “harmful” thing that others could not do.
It seemed clear that he acted on the “believe” that he will be called up by the high levels s oas to be “listened to” and to be given a “appreciation” instead of being “reprimanded for it on the “strength”of being the son of the PM and grandson of MM.
It seemed clear that he knew he can rely on the “strength” of his strong “backings” for his “arrogance” and “hysteria” - a “becoming behaviour” of an officer.
The charge could merely be a “tap” on his wrist. If this had happened to other peers, their rank could be stalled and job could be sidelined into cold storage and into obscurity.
Not following the line of command is a serious matter!!!
I wonder what sort of punishment has he got ?
17 years solitary detention?
Was his scholarship withdrawn ?
Was he demoted ?
Was he court martialled ?
If he had come from ordinary parents,
would it have been treated more seriously
A lot of questions need to be answered?
Has any of our highly paid PAP Ministers
provided any reasonable explanation?
So far, I have only seen a lot of wayang.
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